The second movie introduces an interesting idea of there being a "sense of self" at the heart of Riley's mind, made up of her core beliefs about herself and the world, and how the different possible interpretations and decisions surrounding her experience of the world offered by the different emotions can affect those core beliefs.
I'd enjoy some recommended reading on this subject, preferably from the Christian tradition, rather than Greco-Roman. That's not because I don't love Greco-Roman literature and philosophy, but because I'm working on formulating a specifically biblical philosophy of emotion. The current cultural moment is somewhat unhelpful to me. Here's a bit of context, in case it's helpful: I don't agree completely with the evangelical Christian church position, because they say I don't exist or am in sin (I have a mood disorder that drastically improves with antipsychotics). Neurochemical impulses can do crazy things, by the way. If you've never had a disembodied sense of sheer agony, congratulations on your normal brain. I have, and I'm really thankful for modern medicine. However, I also don't agree with modern psychoanalysts. Thinking of myself as the "puppet" of my neurotransmitters is unappealing at best, and very dangerous when I'm at my worst. My experience has also shown me that I am more than my neurotransmitters, even when they're not working the way they should. I've found more helpful thoughts from older literature. Dealing with intrusive thoughts using the biblical idea of demons has been quite helpful--I've done it for quite some time. Along those same lines, John Bunyan in Pilgrim's Progress described what modern psychiatrists would call intrusive thoughts in terms of a demon whispering blasphemies in Christian's ear as he walked through the Valley of the Shadow of Death. As a child, I resonated with that scene, but didn't realize why until much later. What should I read next?
I also rewatched Inside Out this past week (for the same reason), and specifically speaking of the parent's emotional panels, I saw it in a more positive light. There is joy at life, but there is also sorrow at the heart of it "mourning and weeping in this vale of tears." I think of Tolkien's pantheon, where Nienna is the Valar of Tears and Mourning, and it was through her ministrations that the Sun and Moon came to be. I also think of the Meditation on the Tarot passage about how the characteristic feature of the Buddhist is dry eyes, while the Christian weeps. The emotional attitude we have towards the world is more complicated than either Joy or Sadness. It's somehow both.
Mmm—this does raise another potential take on the movie, which is that “Joy” might be misnamed from a Christian perspective. A lot of the time she really functions as what I would call Happiness. The state you describe—of sorrow and happiness alike embraced in wisdom and love—is closer to what I mean by Joy.
And arguably if you make that adjustment in terminology, the movie is about learning joy—just not joy as the movie uses the word, for understandable reasons.
Yes, I think that is closer to my own perspective. JOY (the state we are discussing) subsists in Joy (the character) in the prologue, but once the movie, as such, starts, the JOY moves on from Joy, such that Joy's efforts to preserve JOY turn into this manic ossification of Riley in the state where she currently is. I think this is best seen by Joy's refusal of anything to be forgotten, especially in her offer to bring Bing Bong back to headquarters. An adult who still has close contact with childhood imaginary friends is certainly not something to aspire to. It strikes me as an act of idolatry, actually, where the image is the childhood nature, and the reality is the JOY.
It requires the yin of Sadness to Joy's yang to restore Joy to Riley, and eventually JOY does not subsist in any of the emotions individually, but in all of them together.
It brings to mind The Faerie Queen. In the first book of it, there are three Saracen knights whom Redcrosse Knight slays, one after another. They are named Sans-foi (without Faith), Sans-loi (without law), and Sans-ioy (without Joy), in that order, which indicates the loss of Faith leads to the loss of obedience to the (Natural) Law, which leads to the loss of Joy.
The second movie introduces an interesting idea of there being a "sense of self" at the heart of Riley's mind, made up of her core beliefs about herself and the world, and how the different possible interpretations and decisions surrounding her experience of the world offered by the different emotions can affect those core beliefs.
Very interesting. Gonna try to watch it tonight.
I'd enjoy some recommended reading on this subject, preferably from the Christian tradition, rather than Greco-Roman. That's not because I don't love Greco-Roman literature and philosophy, but because I'm working on formulating a specifically biblical philosophy of emotion. The current cultural moment is somewhat unhelpful to me. Here's a bit of context, in case it's helpful: I don't agree completely with the evangelical Christian church position, because they say I don't exist or am in sin (I have a mood disorder that drastically improves with antipsychotics). Neurochemical impulses can do crazy things, by the way. If you've never had a disembodied sense of sheer agony, congratulations on your normal brain. I have, and I'm really thankful for modern medicine. However, I also don't agree with modern psychoanalysts. Thinking of myself as the "puppet" of my neurotransmitters is unappealing at best, and very dangerous when I'm at my worst. My experience has also shown me that I am more than my neurotransmitters, even when they're not working the way they should. I've found more helpful thoughts from older literature. Dealing with intrusive thoughts using the biblical idea of demons has been quite helpful--I've done it for quite some time. Along those same lines, John Bunyan in Pilgrim's Progress described what modern psychiatrists would call intrusive thoughts in terms of a demon whispering blasphemies in Christian's ear as he walked through the Valley of the Shadow of Death. As a child, I resonated with that scene, but didn't realize why until much later. What should I read next?
What about imagining elemental beings manifesting the forces of nature instead of chemistry and physics?
I also rewatched Inside Out this past week (for the same reason), and specifically speaking of the parent's emotional panels, I saw it in a more positive light. There is joy at life, but there is also sorrow at the heart of it "mourning and weeping in this vale of tears." I think of Tolkien's pantheon, where Nienna is the Valar of Tears and Mourning, and it was through her ministrations that the Sun and Moon came to be. I also think of the Meditation on the Tarot passage about how the characteristic feature of the Buddhist is dry eyes, while the Christian weeps. The emotional attitude we have towards the world is more complicated than either Joy or Sadness. It's somehow both.
Mmm—this does raise another potential take on the movie, which is that “Joy” might be misnamed from a Christian perspective. A lot of the time she really functions as what I would call Happiness. The state you describe—of sorrow and happiness alike embraced in wisdom and love—is closer to what I mean by Joy.
And arguably if you make that adjustment in terminology, the movie is about learning joy—just not joy as the movie uses the word, for understandable reasons.
Yes, I think that is closer to my own perspective. JOY (the state we are discussing) subsists in Joy (the character) in the prologue, but once the movie, as such, starts, the JOY moves on from Joy, such that Joy's efforts to preserve JOY turn into this manic ossification of Riley in the state where she currently is. I think this is best seen by Joy's refusal of anything to be forgotten, especially in her offer to bring Bing Bong back to headquarters. An adult who still has close contact with childhood imaginary friends is certainly not something to aspire to. It strikes me as an act of idolatry, actually, where the image is the childhood nature, and the reality is the JOY.
It requires the yin of Sadness to Joy's yang to restore Joy to Riley, and eventually JOY does not subsist in any of the emotions individually, but in all of them together.
It brings to mind The Faerie Queen. In the first book of it, there are three Saracen knights whom Redcrosse Knight slays, one after another. They are named Sans-foi (without Faith), Sans-loi (without law), and Sans-ioy (without Joy), in that order, which indicates the loss of Faith leads to the loss of obedience to the (Natural) Law, which leads to the loss of Joy.